Cassandra – what do you mean?

It could be worse, I could live in the North East region or some other indistinct regional area.

The Scots and Welsh keep thier identity and go from one paymaster to the next. The only death is the death of England.

England: Discriminated against through devolution and the Barnett formula.
The English: Discriminated against thanks to devolution on medical treatments, on student fees, on NHS prescriptions and parking
The White English: Discriminated against through the Equality Act.

They say we are a tolerant nation, I think we have become complacent.
Too busy with X factor and Im a celebrity

Andy – no argument from me. I am English and for an English Parliament but I also have Scottish, Welsh and o/s readers so I have to cater for them too. It’s up to us all within the shores of these islands to sort this out but it’s not up to a foreign body, the EU and the traitors at the top in Westminster to do that.

The queen and her MPs have treaty by treaty signed away our rights to democratically decide our countries fate.
The Scots and Welsh have had referendums on devolution, two.
The English had one referendum in one of her ‘so called’ regions and voted overwhelmingly against regional devolution, they recognised that they were English and part of England.

Prescott ignored their voice and refused to allow any more English a say on their future.

England is the most densly populated country in Europe, Labour have bankrupt us (possibly deliberatly) we have a growing public workforce and diminishing private sector.

Less workers paying for a growing population is going to end in tears.
Are the EU going to make Englands industries great again?
Will they pump in the billions every year needed to sort out our country?
Which countries will pump in more money then they get out to fund a country run into the ground by its MPs? Because somebody has to. We havew done it for years, who will recind this favour? The French LOL.

For years the Queen and Westminster with the media have ignored and undermined the English.
So much even you have made the error of confusing English with British.

There is a growing awareness in England of the inequalities heaped upon our shoulders.

When people are loosing jobs and benefits and services get cut then drivil like the X factor and Im a celebrity wont feed or heat families.

Look at the recent strike actions, (misguided) British jobs for British workers!Postal workers dustbin men etc, a change is coming and when the peoples voice is loud enough NO european will keep us members of a union we dont wish to belong, no matter what our EU friendly MPs tell us.

One of its dearest wishes, not the only wish but one of the dearest, is to take England apart – Napoleon’s Bonny Bunch of Roses.

This post was for those considering themselves British, the next one for those considering themselves English.

I should have made that clearer.

Outfits such as the Taxpayers’ Alliance are adding to the movement against the EU, and there’s a lot to be done to keep the issue live and to make it real in peoples’ minds.
What have we North West Province imperial subjects got to lose?

I have thought about this too. If we wait 5 years for the EU to completely wreck our country, what have we got left to rebuild?

Haven’t Labour done a good enough job of bringing this country to its knees as it is with its spreading the love and wealth creating a whole layer of useless, lazy, benefit scrounging (home grown as well as imported) parasites. They’ve wrecked our public services (schools, hospitals etc) by having a free for all the world except for those who have paid into it for years and spend, spend, spend on quangoes, civil services, fake charities, lies and propanda!

How bad can we actually allow it to get? By the time 5 years have passed, France will have stolen our financial sector (thats what they’re planning) and we will be left with virtually nothing.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the UK is eventually earmarked as a giant bloody prison like in that
film “Escape to New York”… perhaps that’s why we’re getting all the criminal filth and trash thrown at us so much now!

” to pump money into regional businesses” Who is paying for this? Our contribution is far greater than we get back from the EU as it is. You can bet your bottom dollar the biggest sums are going to the poorer East European countries and we will end up with well, not a lot, for our share, while they sit back and laugh at us (they are publically doing so already).

I love to see all this regeneration, it just aint gonna happen. This is a socialist regime, it’s the socialist way to keep the peasants poor and make the taxpayers pay for their benefits. They will also insist we take “our fair share” of yet more immigrants, when we know we cannot accommodate anymore bodies in the UK.

The creation of the EU was based on the teachings of the Frankfurt School. It’s so obvious, its embarrassing! Look at the main bullet points for their plans to further the advance of their ‘quiet’ cultural revolution – but giving us no ideas about their plans for the future – the School recommended (among other things):

1. The creation of racism offences.
2. Continual change to create confusion
3. The teaching of sex and homosexuality to children
4. The undermining of schools’ and teachers’ authority
5. Huge immigration to destroy identity.
6. The promotion of excessive drinking
7. Emptying of churches
8. An unreliable legal system with bias against victims of crime
9. Dependency on the state or state benefits
10. Control and dumbing down of media
11. Encouraging the breakdown of the family

http://catholicinsight.com/online/features/article_882.shtml

Do you think this is going to stop here? No, its not.. they’re getting their first taste of real power now and if you thought Bliar and Brown were megalomaniacs, you ain’t seen nothing yet!

It’s never too late for a revolution. If the politicians won’t move, we will have to do it. Sod the EU, sod the politicians, they’re all after lining their pockets.

England, my country, ceased to exist today but Scotland goes on, albeit as a region. Ditto Wales. So, admittedly, the RIP is for England.

Trooper – yes, it needs to be now for the reasons stated.

James writes, concerning my 3rd paragraph: Nigel, … [T]he “You” was interesting, indicating that perhaps you’re of a different nationality? [new paragraph] If so, then forgive my reactions on occasions – I somehow saw you as British.

In my 1st and 2nd paragraphs, I had intended to give the view that I disapproved of foreign payments influencing UK elections and referenda. Thus, my ‘you’ (and what followed) was to give James (and others, some doubtless in the Albion Alliance) the opportunity to object or not on the same grounds; also to object or not on grounds of unbalanced funding. I do agree that my wording lacked perfection; however, I don’t think there should be doubt there as to my Britishness, and nor (really) to my view that other EU countries (separately or together) should stay the bloody hell out of it while the UK decides which of several options on Europeanism (all preferably, politely and in advance, agreed as tolerable with the rest of the EU and other European ‘groupings’) it wants to go with.

James also writes, and it must be with reference to me: You mention 55%, most polls had 78-83%. Let’s not quibble over percentages.

Perhaps I did (something does ring a bell), but I cannot find that in the current comment stream, nor in the one to which I link, nor can I find it in my personal comment archive going back to mid-July. If it is material to the current discussion, a direct reference would be appreciated.

And James writes: Your penultimate and final paragraphs made some good points.

I am delighted that James and I have some points of agreement on this.

I’d also like to say, just in case there are other interpretations, that I have a great love and respect for the Scottish as a people. They often remind me of the English at their best: especially on common sense, education, science and philosophy (whisky too). However, I don’t think this will change if they stay within the EU and England does not (though there will doubtless be some modest decrease in convenience for me personally). If James ever posts on Scotland vis-a-vis England, I might write more.

Best regards

If so, then forgive my reactions on occasions – I somehow saw you as British.

Within Britain though, people who considered themselves so and are now not, as of today, have become that way as a result of the actions of “foreign potentates” and the collusion of Westminster politicians who signed the document which led to today occurring.

There is a list of these politicians. Today’s situation is what they wanted – Britain to break up into 12 regions of the EU and they see no problem with what I and many others perceive as treason.

The reason I call it treason, and not in any wild manner, is that this change occurred not only without the approval of the people of this nation [at least Ireland had two referenda to get there] but also in the face of a clear call of a majority of people to have such a referendum.

You mention 55%, most polls had 78-83%. Let’s not quibble over percentages.

There is no way that any Brit can look at this post, at today’s events and say that this has been legitimate.

Your penultimate and final paragraphs made some good points.

Sorry, Cassandra and Sackers – our comments crossed. Yes, it is a known strategy. Sackers – I’ve replied to the Dan Hannan piece.

http://thehuntsman2007.blogspot.com/2009/12/you-can-lead-horse-to-water.html

I’m sure that political parties of any view would dearly love to have big tranches of EU or other government money in support of their case. It is not out of the question that Parliament might legislate to legalise such funding and even to vote for more of it. However, IMHO, such funding would invalidate the result of any referendum. Thus the result of such a referendum should not be viewed as, in any way, binding on the UK citizenry.

If you object to such funding on the grounds of foreign interference, or you think funding would be partisan against your stance, start lobbying now for any foreign funding (including that from any conglomeration of states such as the EU and the UN) and any funding directly or indirectly by UK taxpayers to be firmly restated as invalid and illegal funding for the purposes of any elections, including referenda.

Concerning EU gerrymandering, I have a small number of views. Firstly, the sooner there is a referendum, the less chance the EU has of such gerrymandering. Secondly, terms of withdrawal should include a gradual scaling down of net fund movements; thus, if the EU bribes us with (non-UK) EU money, they will have to go on paying it for years after we withdraw; however, if there is a net outflow of funds from the UK, the EU will gain. Thirdly, if Scotland and any other independently governed part of the UK wish to have a separate referendum, that’s fine by me: the English-only vote will not move in the EU’s favour.

Finally, I commend to you again, my proposed 5-way vote by STV. By having 3 of the 5 options in favour of withdrawal from the EU (and into nothing or some EFTA-like trading block), your view does better than the 1 of the 2 choices in the ‘simpler’ vote. By asking the fuller question, I believe you will get a result more to your liking than otherwise. This is, not least, because many in the UK are currently very disillusioned with political manipulation: the fuller question, with less room for subsequent political manoeuvring, will make them more likely to become engaged and more likely to believe their view will actually make a difference.

Best regards